I got this in my RSS feeds. Hopefully, it has some tips or suggestions you might find helpful
Believe it or not, that’s written by one of the guys at Hardware Unboxed. I forgot they post stuff to Techspot.
That is a lot of useful info guys, thank you very much !
I see this monitor has 5ms lag , is it an issue for you ? Playing FPS or such.
DO NOT BUY FROM NEWEGG!
Haven’t read thread yet, but basically, if you want 1080p, go with a 24" (or 23" to 25") monitor.
If you want 1440p, go with a 27" monitor.
If you want 4K, anything 27" and above.
If you want to play competitive games such as League, R6S, OW, etc, then get a minimum of 120Hz, usually 144Hz though.
Also, for low response times, TN wins, but TN has bad viewing angles, so IPS is considered to be better for general uses.
My personal recommendation would be a 27" 1440p IPS Monitor, with a refresh rate of 144Hz, and a minimum of 5ms response times, since IPS can’t do true 1ms.
In that category, the LG 27GL83A ($380) is usually considered to be the absolute winner at a decent price point, but it rarely goes on sale, since it is so popular. It went on sale only once, about 2 months ago. There is another $500 version of this monitor, but unless you’re doing some intense color accurate graphic design, just stick with the 83A.
I personally have a dual-monitor setup, both are the same model, namely the ViewSonic VX2758-2KP-MHD, and I am really satisfied. One of them has a stuck pixel, but oh well.
Also, I got the above two monitors on sale, that’s why I bought them, else I would have 100% gone with the 27GL83A.
Other brands, such as Acer and ASUS, have some bad reputation due to bad QA, but if you can find a good deal, definitely jump on them.
Long time Newegg buyer, since about 2005. I still buy there, through necessity rarely.
I concur entirely though.
Buy from Amazon or other places. Why? If something is wrong with your product, they make you pay not only for the shipping (which is expensive af) but a HUGE restocking fee which gets cut out of the price of your product price (so if you return a GPU, so to say, for your actual price after replacing it they cut that price of it so you don’t get all your money back (happened to me twice)). It is beyond ridiculous. Not only this, but I have had consistent and horrible experiences with products having bad packaging, and some products being cosmetically damaged because of it.
Amazon will cover free replacement shipping, and if something gets lost in shipping to you, they will replace it asap (had it happen twice once with a TV and once with a motherboard, which newegg will just laugh and say “tough tiddies said the kitty then the milk ran dry”). Also, no restocking fees.
Only buy from Newegg if that is your only option and said product is so absurdly discounted that you’ll be saving tons of $$$$.
As for brands, I personally recommend something like BenQ, LG, ViewSonic, but the higher up ASUS and Acer products are good as well. It is true their cheaper products have really bad reputations, and for good reason, but that can be said for anything. Then it just depends on what you want to spend, what type of panel you want (and seriously, this is REALLY important), size etc.
For me? No. Average human reaction time is 0.25 seconds (that’s 250 ms for anyone bad at math) and 5 ms is 2% of that. Now, there will always be people claiming they can tell the difference for every ms of lag, but you tell me if 5 ms is going to ruin your gaming experience. Your mouse (even if it’s wired) has more lag than that.
This video has a good summary of some gaming mouse lag times at 8:16
The information presented in this post is inaccurate or false. The average reaction time of a human may be 0.25 seconds but your perception time is much much better. Your mouse/keyboard can be polled at 1000Hz (I know my keyboard is because it has options for it.). Keep in mind that the video is testing the latency of the mouse + the computing time for a frame + the display lag. Also because they’re relying on frames from a framebuffer as an endpoint for their measurement they are introducing variability in the experiment (240hz monitor → ±4ms time to render a frame → 2ms delay on average with ±2ms deviation). In general LTT stuff is useless on this.
Because human perception is pretty good, a slow mouse is definitely noticeable. Overall the more lag you add to the system the less immersed you will be, if you disagree, I invite you to try out some outdated VR headsets.
As to what display to buy? A decent quality IPS panel over a TN panel any day. They make IPS panels with pretty low latency nowadays anyway and the image is much nicer to look at.
So far every cool choice you amazing people gave me is out of stock everywhere i look downhere so i guess i;ll keep on looking.
I found a lot of affordable IPS Dells but all of them have very slow response time for some reason.
By the way, if you do any kind of productivity or play games that suit it, you might want to consider 21:9 format monitor. I for one love mine for uni work, being able to have 3 documents next to each other is great.
Response times are a bit of marketing. Sometimes it represents the time it takes to go from white to black and sometimes it’s the response time from one shade to another. So keep that in mind when you evaluate them from more reputable sellers like Dell.
That’s the thing. I’m not entirely sure how much will it affect everyday use. Those dells claim 8ms response time while most of the monitors these days claim 1ms so a huge difference.
I’d take those numbers with a big grain of salt, if possible you should try some different monitors in a computer store and see if you can perceive a difference. 8ms response time is the time from white to black (generally, sometimes it is Gray2Gray, sometimes it is not mentioned), not the time for the image to start appearing. I wouldn’t focus too much on them if I were you.
Those ratings are usually GTG or MPRT. Gtg is grey to grey and I forget what MPRT stands for. As I understand both are kinda bogus.
I love the way you say I’m lying:
Then admit it’s correct:
then change direction:
Here’s the friendly, civilized way to disagree: “While human reaction time may be X, I believe perceptual resolution (Y) is the more important factor here.” I don’t disagree, and it’s a good point. Then you would provide some numbers instead of mudslinging. I can do that for you, too: perceptual resolution for simultaneity in visual stimuli is 20 - 30 ms. Still way way higher than 5 ms (or the 4 ms delta it probably makes more sense to talk about).
That’s the one I linked you … in the first reply post to this thread and my bad I wasn’t really throughout and through and didn’t provided much of an explanation at all. I’m sorry if something I typed doesn’t make much sense or meaning, but it’s been a long work day for me.
Won’t go into technicalities about monitors, because those have already been mentioned or being mentioned right now
I will back story my process a bit: In my field of work I’ve worked with tons of monitors… big… small, curved, flat … from years on years. In gaming I tried to play quake 3 arena and quake live competitively for years, so I know better than most how important response time is (Quake is the only shooter ever made in my book ;]) and I plugged my 17 inch CRT 125 Hz LG for that same reason up to like 6-7 years ago. Nothing could beat CRT… It’s almost non beatable now as well, but that’s another story. Not to mention the far better colors compared to modern monitors (not including ultra sharp technology by Dell, because those aren’t budget at all).
When I started to build my own PC build (didn’t made one since 10 years, because I used laptops for the mobility and the ability to do field work when traveling) my monitor choice went to this one as a main >
I need 3 in total for multitasking, but the middle one needs to satisfy my needs to try hard in competitive shooters. This has insane build quality and options for it’s price so I went to check it out locally and I was pretty impressed. 144 Hz… great view angles… The stand is heavier than the monitor itself (or the same weight) with insane adjustability options.
I ended up buying 2x60 Hz from the older versions of this exact monitor from 2017, because this is for sure my choice for a “main - gaming” one and they were great price for the same build quality and comfort. I need to move to a new apartment pretty soon and I need to order 2,2 meter long desk when I get there to put all of them on top. I don’t have space for this thing to keep it in the box even, but it dictated my side monitors choice and currently I’m only with them and they are amazing… I do need 144 Hz though, so can’t wait to buy it when I have the desk to put it on as long as Quake Champions isn’t dead on player numbers
I linked you the 27 inch version, because you want it bigger… and it seems it can go a bit faster even - 155 Hz overclocked
Important thing to note, this 1ms response time that my LG has refers to how long it takes a pixel to go from grey through to grey again and 1ms will mean no ghosting. It is not a measure of input latency. So some monitor manufacturers advertise 1ms response time in a way that makes you think of latency instead which is a bit deceptive imo. In reality it will be more than 1 ms between your mouse click and the animation appearing on screen. Look up latency charts instead if you want a super snappy input response.
I stand by my statement, the information in your post is inaccurate or false.
I admit it could in some cases be correct. For competitive gamers it is likely incorrect.
I don’t care much for euphemisms when something is misleading.
Surely just a misunderstanding, I don’t recall making malicious allegations to you. If you’re referring to the mudslinging at LTT, he deserves it after the years of leeching and misinformation.
My post was never meant to be malicious (towards you).
I don’t have any links to quality papers on this. The reality is that judging perception, immersion or feel is way more complicated than simply comparing to the raw numbers of how fast a human processes visual input. In this case the most useful statistic would be on visual perception linked to sensory perception.
Next, the total lag in your system is already > 15ms (according to the LTT video). This is already pretty close to your proposed perceptual resolution and thus it is possible that adding any more will start to be noticeable.
IIRC these studies typically are testing very simple situations where they show you one image after the other, which is not a test for perception of fluidity. I can’t find the study I was looking at before now and I’m also not a neuroscientist so maybe you can link your findings?
Furthermore, the sooner the image appears on your screen, the sooner that 20-30ms visual perception resolution timer starts, the sooner you get to react to the image. Thus lowering latency would almost always be desirable. Of course, if you’re playing on a 60 Hz monitor, you only get to see a new image every 16.(6) ms so it doesn’t make much sense to reduce the total latency much below that, since it wouldn’t be drawn in the screen on time anyway.
The point I’m making is not that one should strive to buy a minimal lag system, personally I replaced all my screens with IPS over TN since TN looks horrible. I’m just saying that if you are buying new gear, you should be wary of both the people saying “it doesn’t matter your reaction time is slow anyway” and the people saying “you need to get a TN panel with a gaming mouse and a …”. Everyone should buy the gear they are most comfortable with, hence why I said the following:
Marketing and misinformation is terrible in this scene. I’m just bringing up my own experience and points I came across doing my own research. And now, I will stop derailing this thread.
I agree with this for competitive FPS, but believe making compromises on latency and frame rate are acceptable nowadays in favour of colour gamut and viewing angles if you’re not playing for money.
For the latency dumpster-fire:
Monitor Technology roll-up:
For the following monitor review, the updated methodology (some are before the switch)
Pixio PX275H
Viewsonic Alphabet Soup:
AOC CQ27G2
LG 27GL850 (I saw this and now I want it )
The video version of the Techspot article linked by @delenn13
Pixio PX7 Prime
I don’t have a video for the Dell 27" linked. but it appears to be a decent one.
In this Microsoft Research video, you can clearly perceive latencies as low as 10ms: Applied Sciences Group: High-Performance Touch - Microsoft Research