Did Nvidia massage their ray tracing demo during their RTX presentation

Interesting video here, comparing CPU ray tracing to what Nvidia showed was possible on their Turing architecture cards -

Anyone pre-order one of the 20xx series? Does anyone really feel they’re worth the price premium that they’ve been loaded with? Do you really care about ray tracing?

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no,yes,no

i’m curious about that
since the initial performance reviews i saw made it look like they were far from worth the premium, costing twice as much as last gen(“here”), but being “a fraction”(30% ish avg) better
which doesn’t really seem to warrant that hefty price increase, like i can grab a 1080 - 1080ti for almost half the price of the RTX, yet they are “at best”/only in a few instances, even 50% better, which still wouldn’t warrant that high increased price
seems like performance/$ is going down even more “these days”
not to mention raytracing seems like a pipedream at the moment with barely any games going to actually take advantage of it yet to warrant that cost either for the moment

(PS anyone kinda laughed at Nvidia stock dipping after the first reviews broke embargo and lamenting RTX “hype” performance?)

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They must be worthfull for someone.

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yea yea, no doubt, otherwise stuff like Bugatti and other stuff wouldn’t have a market, and for 4k it’s definitely going to be an “it” thing, since Pascal might not exactly have done it it 100% smooth/perfect in X games fully blown out
but, as a “grump”, i look at my numbers on the board,

(1080-1080ti) 4000/6000+
vs
(RTX2080-280ti) 7000kr/11000kr+: +50% performance…

those numbers just doesn’t seem to add up “in my head”/to me (i know it makes sense business-wise, i’m just not seeing it like that from a “value” standpoint)

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You mean the 2080ti right? Prices are ropey here in the UK (thanks Brexit) but not ropey enough for it to be the 2080 you’re comparing with. The draw is of course the ray tracing and the DLSS algorithm…although looking at some of the reports on overclocking and hitting power limits on the cards I really can’t believe the rush of people to order them.

It’s a shame that 1080ti stocks are so rapidly depleting because If pricing continues in this way, their next release (which is possibly 7nm) will cost a small fortune and it might be worth investing in a 1080ti and keeping it for 1080p gaming for the 6 or 7 years.

Perhaps the 20xx drivers will mature and boost performance? Honestly think that AMD are probably a better option despite their issues.

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i mean i can grab “each” for nearly half of their RTX equivalent 1080 = 4000kr (and up to 4800) RTX 2080 from 7000-8000kr, 1080ti starting at 5700-6600kr, while RTX 2080ti is not even in stock and pre stock price starting at 10500-11500 (when they switch to “in stock” the price usually increase here)
that’s almost a full 100% increase in price from Pascal to Turing, yet “now” they do nowhere near a 100% increase in performance, and probably never well. (and i’m quite aware that’s not how business, tech/pricing works, just pointing out performance/$ doesn’t add up and seems to get lower each release)

as to drivers and games optimization/taking advantage of it i have these grumpy view points
1st, just like with dx12, it’s gonna be a long ass while before the tech gets mainstream, by that time we’ll probably have 2.gen or 3rd gen raytracing cards on the market if not some other new "ahmagawd hype"tech. (what’s on the plate, like 2 dozen games maybe atm/upcoming?)

Then: most games “bend” by sway of the console market, and since even pascal utterly floors current gen tupperware, and probably even with whatever new they got incoming as these are dying off, means that devs might do less than fckall to proper optimize for PC. Meaning either you get games that don’t take advantage of your cards, because why bother when the majority of the market (both console and pc) is not gonna be counted in for those beasts, and you’ll have an unlocked framerate that makes your monitor start to slowly defy gravity, (or a locked fps or even Vsync that completely makes it moot anyway).
Or you get piss poor optimization where you need a gd dang Titan just to run at stable framerates on 1360x768 because devs couldn’t be bothered to do a decent port or optimize it, and just figured anyone going above med settings would have such card these days.

Can’t speak to how it will mature, never knows what the future brings, (and i haven’t bothered to keep up with what AMD got in store for us), tho it/drivers can sorta only go up from here i suppose
but i’'m sharing your thoughts on “hmm, might it juuust be worth it to snag a 1080ti “now” and just go for the duration”, it does look might attractive right now “in comparison” atm
my only/usual speculation is just, (as always), “but what if the next one is even better/more worth it”:thinking:… i fcn hate hindsight :man_facepalming:

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Right now 1080Ti and 2080 cards are selling for just about the same prices here. So I guess if you get 50% more performance out of it then 2080 seems to be the way to go. Well the cheapest 1080Ti I can get is about 7800 SEK and the cheapest 2080 is 9000 SEK, but most 1080Ti cards are hovering between 9-10k along with most 2080s.

Amusingly at the most expensive end 1080Ti is coming out on top at this particular store.

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:no_mouth:
2 diff stores here, maybe worthwhile to consider shopping “across the bridge” then ? :thinking: :smile:

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That falls about along the exchange rate, so maybe it’s better for you to come here and buy a mid-priced 2080 for 9500 SEK, 6800 DKK.

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:smile: why was i under the impression the SEK and DKK was a bit closer to the “1:1” than it was ? :dizzy_face: :man_facepalming: :rofl: -yea that might actually not be such big savings there then :+1:
those 2 are definitely closer in performance comparison where it could be considered a 1:1 swap (with the right price) -provided the tech+drivers makes the (small?) price difference/increase worth it “over time” :thinking:

damnit… i don’t need “more” options to weigh this month :confounded: :joy:

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Assuming we class 1080 and up as top end hardware, look at the distribution from the Steam hardware charts -
https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/videocard/

There’s no incentive for devs to go all out and assume that their target market has the top end cards simply because they don’t. I’m seriously considering going for a card that I’d never normally consider, purely due to the potential costs of future GPU’s. A 1080ti would probably last me a decade…although I doubt that the hardware itself would last that long, rendering the investment pointless - I have a 60Hz 1080 monitor. Realistically, unless prices come down crazily I figure that a 1070Ti or 1080 is probably the most sensible choice for a card to last. I’ve been putting off PC gaming due to my aged PC being a limiting factor (hence my PS3 gaming lately) so this Black Friday is ultimately going to be critical in my upgrade plans…although I don’t see the 1080Ti stocks lasting that long anyway.

With the 7nm GPU’s being rumoured to arrive soon, especially with AMD’s 7nm offering at the end of the year, the Turing cards could be an expensive waste of time. I’m keeping that in mind too. Plus with the Vega 64 power problems being ameliorated by Wattman and undervolting, and the prevalence of cheap Freesync monitors, that could also be a very sensible option. I just hope AMD can pull something out the bag and give Nvidia a big surprise, although I think it’s doubtful. Lack of competition is killing the consumer market, although with Intel entering the GPU business things should get shaken up a little.

As it stands visual effects are not my thing so RTX and ray tracing doesn’t interest me. Heck, my HD 5870 is close to a decade old and it’s given me some great experiences so whatever card I get has a lot to live up to!

The scary thing for Nvidia is that nothing has been seen yet, and if the author of that youtube video is right, Nvidia are selling snake oil and smoke rather than ray traced dreams.

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totally, but i didn’t just mean these beasts, as in the top line, i meant as in turing all together, i’m gonna take a stab that even 2060 is gonna blow so much smoke up Sony And MS boxes, that this entire lineup is gonna remain potentially partially unused/“not proper optimized for”(on the game side, not driver) until the next gen consoles arrive, and that there will be “waste” somewhere along the lines, because the vast majority of games gets made with console hardware in mind “first”
and that if for some reason they don’t follow suit on next gen, say sticking with AMD and amd has a diff approach, like with asynch compute, then it doesn’t matter what Nvidia offers, if they don’t get the rest of the world to get on board “their” way, and we just end up with cards that are gimped in one half the benchmarks and and tops the other
i think what i’m trying to say more concise; it doesn’t so much matter what these cards offer for gaming “now”, but what the console brings next, and how this specific tech approach/Nvidia handling fares then there/against theirs
(-unless Nvidia totally killed it with this and happened to be their usual brute force and +tech/“flair” this time, to where it will just powerhouse through anything/any approach they decide on for the next gen console or amd gpu (or when next console is actually “finally” gonna arrive on the market ofc) :smile:)

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Well, with AMD providing the graphics for the PS5, and the fact that the ray tracing demos struggled to maintain a solid 30FPS at 1080, I don’t see ray tracing coming to a console near you any time soon. AMD have their uber compute performance, and are capable of ray tracing tech too, but it remains to be seen if they adopt it. After all despite it’s benefits Vulkan has hardly been used in games development, so unless Nvidia pour money into developers pockets I can’t see that many being bothered by ray tracing. DLSS on the other hand seems like it could be more attractive, but I’m currently unsure why this sort of feature couldn’t be added to any new cards.

Nvidia have had it so good, for so long, and with AMD offering little in the way of competition they can pretty much make their own rules up. Hopefully we’ll see some turn around, but sadly it’s difficult to be optimistic since AMD’s last set of superior cards was years ago. It’s lucky their CPU side is booming to claw back some profits, and it remains to be seen how Navi and Lisa Su’s influence pans out, but unless Intel’s GPU’s destroy, Nvidia can keep on Nvidia’ing until ultimately PC gaming has been ground into ash and everyone leaves for consoles.

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I wasn’t expecting much for these first-gen ray tracing cards after hearing about how low the frame rates were in the game demos shown. I was able to grab a b- stock (refurbished) GTX 1080 from EVGA for $329 a couple of weeks ago and I think it was a good choice. I was a little worried that if the RTX doesn’t sell as well as planned after release that Nvidia might sit in their existing GTX stock to keep the prices from dropping too fast, and at worst increase a bit from the current prices.

It looks like the RTX are best for high res gaming like 4K, so most gamers still can’t really utilize the extra performance. At 1080 resolutions the processor seems to be the bottleneck on frame rates because it can’t pass enough data to the GPU that otherwise could increase the frame rates. Ray tracing won’t become the standard for a while since there’s not a lot of software supporting it yet. The new tech on the RTX cards may find a niche in high-end computing for commercial applications. Professionals in scientific fields may have the budgets to buy these cards and put them into multi-GPU setups so they may actually turn out be quite successful for Nvidia outside of the expected market. I don’t think they offer the average gamer a reasonable value at their current prices, though.

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